Hands of Justice
What we have played => EVE Online => Topic started by: Mangala on December 07, 2008, 12:10:11 AM
-
I'll expand on this post when I can actually see further than my keyboard, but Agony Unleashed (http://www.agony-unleashed.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewforum.php?2) offer regular courses in various aspects of pvp.
They have a facility where a corp can pay an amount and then its members just sign up for the classes that interest them, after meeting the prereq's for said course (certain skills trained or ships able to pilot etc), I'd be willing to fund the corp account with Agony should anyone be interested in this. (again I'll flesh this out when its more than a random drunk idea wandering through my mind).
I think this may be easier than doing our own spot of lowsec gate camping or wardeccing of some locals in our area - although easier option still is to all sit in frigates and shoot/tackle/etc etc etc each other that way as corpies can do that without police interference.
-
I am interested for sure in anything PvP related :) PvP will be something I'll stumble on anyway at some point, and if there is something I can do to prepare myself for that, then yes I am in :)
-
Same!
-
Sounds fun (must set up a jump clone first)
my skill set is more around the ewar /tackling skills so id be in a supporting role rather than a pew pew role, plus i can shield boost ;)
-
Having had a quick look at their courses ,they seem to do a decent line in 'introduce you to the game, and the thrill of eve PVP'.
I might even spec up a starter character with the minimums and join you guys for kicks. What are the minimums?
-
1. Enrolment
Make sure have correctly enrolled in the class, that you know when it is, and that your payment has been made (either by yourself, or through a corporate account on your behalf).
2. Connect to the "AU_PVP_UNIVERSITY" channel
Within your EVE client go to 'channels and mailing lists' and add "AU_PVP_UNIVERSITY" - you'll need to be on this channel during the class, and it can be very helpful when making arrangements or asking for help with things.
3. Connect to the ventrilo server
Download the Voice Communications in PVP article and follow the instructions there on connecting to our Ventrilo server. This gives you even more options when it comes to asking us for help. NOTE: If you don't have a microphone, you still need to connect to Ventrilo so you can listen to the class. There is no point in attending if you can't hear the instructor!
4. Check your skills
The skills you need to have before the class starts are listed in the enrolment thread for that class. At the time of this document they are:
* Propulsion Jamming 1+
* Afterburner 1+
* Caldari, Amarr, Gallente or Minmatar Frigate 1+
* Sensor Linking 1+
* Warp Drive Operation 3+ (yes, we really mean it - you may be asked to warp 200AU, and if you don't have this skill it can delay the movement of the fleet)
* Target Painting 1+
* Weapon Disruption 1+
* Electronic Warfare 1+
5. (Optional) Prepare your jump clone
You're going to want a jump clone at Nonni V - Lai Dai Corporation (or at the class location if it is not in Nonni) in time for the start of the class. The pod survival rate in our Basic classes is around 95% - most people don't lose any ships, and most people who lose their ship don't lose their pod. But losing all your implants is something we'd prefer you didn't risk. If you are unable to secure jumpclones without Agony's help, we will attempt to get you to a station in 0.0 where you can set up a jump clone. To do this, you will need Infomorph Psychology I and a shuttle. Ask on the au_pvp_university channel and we can arrange an armed escort for you.
6. Set your autopilot for Nonni
Nonni is a reasonably major manufacturing center, and is definitely the best place to buy your frigates so that you won't have to haul them. Other trade hubs in the area are Sobaseki (4 jumps from Nonni) and Jita (5 jumps from Nonni). Torrinos (8 jumps from Nonni) tends to be well-stocked, but it also tends to be expensive.
Note: Not all classes are held in Nonni!
7. Start reading the rest of the articles, browse the PVP-Basic forum
The PVP-Basic articles can be found here. Here's the PVP-Basic forum.
8. Buy your frigates
Choose one type of frigate that you think you'll enjoy for the duration of the class. Having your class frigates in different types seems like a really good idea in theory, but in practice it tends to be frustrating and annoying. Don't choose a frigate with a mining laser bonus. Don't choose a frigate with an astrometrics bonus. Don't choose an assault frigate, interceptor, or stealth frigate - they require different techniques to fly than a tech 1 frigate, and we won't be covering those techniques in this class. We usually don't use target painters in the BASIC class, so don't choose a Vigil.
Once you've chosen a type of frigate, buy at least two of them, three if you can afford it. Five if you're planning on making a regular habit of travelling into 0.0 or lowsec with the classes.
9. Buy afterburners
Each of your frigates is going to need an afterburner. For certain frigates, this doesn't give optimal combat performance, but it's the right choice for most frigates. There are a number of training exercises where the instructor will say "turn on your afterburner" - not having one means you miss out on some of the educational value. Don't buy or fit microwarp drives, when we say 'afterburner' we mean 'afterburner'. If you feel like fitting named, t2 or faction afterburners, then go for it. Just remember that in 0.0, the real question is not 'if' you lose your ship, but 'when'.
10. Buy midslot and lowslot items
Have a look at the recommended modules for BASIC and try to collect the full set. If you've chosen a frigate that gets a bonus to ewar modules (Crucifier, Griffin, or Maulus) make sure you have all the modules from the collection that you get a bonus to using. (Tracking disruptors, ECM varieties, or sensor damps, respectively.) As with the afterburners, feel free to get expensive kit if you can afford to lose it.
11. Buy highslot items
The midslot items are vitally important to a hydra fleet, so you buy those and make sure you can fit them before you look at fitting weapons. Be aware that different midslot items require different amounts of CPU - don't be afraid to use lighter-caliber guns to make sure you can equip your ewar. (If you're loaded with cash, consider buying a mixture of gun calibers so that you can maximise your punch once the ewar is finalized during the class. Similarly, named modules can help, if you can afford to lose them.)
12. Buy ammunition
400 rounds per weapon should see you through nicely. If possible, bring an ammunition type that gives you an optimal range around 9km, and as an ammunition type that gives an optimal range roughly equal to your frigate's fastest circular orbit.
13. Gather everything at the class location
Careful here - there's more than one Lai Dai station in Nonni. Most classes are in Nonni but not all! So check. Also, some classes are held on the test server. If your class is based on the test server it will plainly say so in the booking thread.
14. Fit out your frigates and insure them
Set up your frigates with identical fittings in every slot and get the platinum insurance on each. During the class, you're reasonably likely to be asked to change your fittings around, but you may as well make certain that there's at least one configuration that works.
15. Set your medical clone to the class location
In the unfortunate event that you do get podded, waking up 50 jumps away from the class would ruin your evening.
16. (Optional) Finalize your jumpclone arrangements
You're going to want the clone with all your implants to be in some other station, so you can use an implantless clone for class.
17. Configure your overview and your graphics settings
Follow the configuration instructions that are a part of the BASIC course material. Yes, you really do need to turn off your sound and effects, and you really do need to set up your overview so that you can't see anything beyond the essentials. If you don't do this and you're lucky, your overview will be cluttered and you might cause a friendly fire incident. If you're unlucky, your client will crash when you jump into a system full of hostiles.
Congratulations, you're ready to attend BASIC!
hunted down requirements on there site ;)
-
This look very cool =)
-
i would like this at some point, will need to learn some skills first though
-
Interest seems great, indeed. I'll setup the corporate account with AU this evening. Then we can start watching out for their classes, skilling for them etc and getting them done. They do a huge number of them and have recently starting offering courses for budding FC's too :)
-
Interest seems great, indeed. I'll setup the corporate account with AU this evening. Then we can start watching out for their classes, skilling for them etc and getting them done. They do a huge number of them and have recently starting offering courses for budding FC's too :)
I'd be interested in the higher-end and FC courses. Let me know when we get there as a corp.
X
-
FC ain't in the abbreviations overview and my mind ain't flexible enough to figure it out myself. Please enlighten me...
-
FC ain't in the abbreviations overview and my mind ain't flexible enough to figure it out myself. Please enlighten me...
I just had to ask the same question in chat this afternoon, it's Fleet Commander (say, raid leader)
-
Do i has all the required skills? Check yes i do ;)
train me in PVP pew pew.
-
Ok so im wet at the thought of learning Eve PVP so i played with a tackle frigate in EFT
(http://handsofjustice.co.uk/forum/gallery/1_08_12_08_4_52_49.jpg)
Thoughts please, i need to train drone skills to use the Acolyte hence the red but everything else is with my current skills.
-
(http://image69.webshots.com/669/2/65/46/2023265460103493491hcYbWv_ph.jpg)[/URL]
403 forbidden on that URL
-
worked on preview sorted hopefully ;)
-
worked on preview sorted hopefully ;)
Webshots being silly.
I hosted it over on the forum gallery and linked it in your post now.
-
As for thoughts, use a griffin for distance EW. Use a merlin for a tackler :)
Fit to follow.
-
As for thoughts, use a griffin for distance EW. Use a merlin for a tackler :)
Fit to follow.
(http://travel.jonsimmers.com/pictures/albums/userpics/Merlin_-_Tackler.jpg)
-
Corp account with Agony is now up and running. Please register at their forums and keep an eye on class dates. You are looking for PVP-Basic currently. (They do two variants of this, one for the world and one for Australian time zone players).
Also ingame you can join their chat channel and mailing list as detailed here on their site (http://www.agony-unleashed.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?81643).
Please ENSURE when you enrol in a class, following their instructions you tell them that the Ma'adim Logisitics (MAADI) corp account is paying for your class.
-
http://www.agony-unleashed.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?104994
Links to an article on the Agony forums, written by someone from EVE Uni who has taken a basic class recently. Really good read there, and makes me wish they'd hurry up and setup the next one!
-
http://www.agony-unleashed.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?106169
SIGN UP!!!!
-
Did you see where Berta is btw? Frickin other side of space. Hard for me to get a jumpclone near there fast, so I'll just hope I wont get podkilled.
Hope you can freighter some frigates and modules for me to there Mang?
-
1. You don't need a jumpclone there, just jump to a clone here and fly there.
2. 16-20 jumps is only 20 minutes with warp-to-zero, you should have played when it was warp to 15km as the closest
3. if you go to 0.0, then you will get podded, set your clone to the station you go to, have a jumpclone without implants.
Enjoy, this sounds like a blast ...
-
I'll be at work during that weekend sadly. In theory I could slip away from work a bit earlier on Saturday to make it in time, but I really can't stay up until the early hours of Sunday as I have to be at work 6 AM server time on Sunday...
-
1. You don't need a jumpclone there, just jump to a clone here and fly there.
2. 16-20 jumps is only 20 minutes with warp-to-zero, you should have played when it was warp to 15km as the closest
3. if you go to 0.0, then you will get podded, set your clone to the station you go to, have a jumpclone without implants.
Enjoy, this sounds like a blast ...
2. aye, but i will need me a collection of ships and stuff there, that will be a drag if i have to make several haultrips to get my stuff there
1&3. ahh, never mind, i made some reasoning error there, thought i had to have a jumpclone close to where i died, figure I need to learn Infomorph psychology IRL too :-\
-
My most recent kills - or at least those I was involved in:
http://www.handsofjustice.co.uk/maadikb/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=39011&view=recent
(They wont show on the front page as mang is in kasei currently)
MAADI losses so far:
http://www.handsofjustice.co.uk/maadikb/?a=losses
-
Excellent fun.
I have more to say when I have slept a little.
-
Eagerly waiting for an AAR :)
-
Ok, writeup of the basics from yesterday, let others do the more juicy details.
Class started with balancing the fleet (about 50 boats) using an ingame webpage where everyone could enter their loadouts so that the fleet coordinator (FC) could see what was missing and what we had too much of. After some ppl changing loadouts to fit FC's taste, explaining what did what, going over communication rules and assigning ppl to groups and squads in fleet, we undocked.
Oh no! Class started 15 minutes before Beo cared to arrive, that was how it started! :D
Several basic (fleet) flight techniques were then explained to us. Among others:
- When warping as a fleet, everyone aligning to the target beforehand will make you warping and arriving in one group, thus having more chance to surprise and kill a target. Even with fast ships like frigates, the aligning takes time and this will cause delays in a lot of ppls warp.
- Spiraling towards a targets was explained and practiced. Essentially it means that when you have to travel a distance (say 50 km) to a battleship in a frigate in a straight line, he is able to hit you easily. When you travel in a 45o angle towards him, he will have a harder time hitting you, cause his guns will have to track you.
We were told this also applies to missiles. In this case it is not the tracking, but the explosion velocity that has to keep up with you. Getting hit head on is worse than getting hit from behind.
- Next up was orbiting speed. They went into detail about orbiting, rad/sec and stuff. I already studied this myself when thinking about speedtank tactics, so not many surprises for me there.
What was also a major theme of the course was communications. Agony uses several keywords for different situations. Like certain codes for everyone to shut up and listen, emercency codes (another shut up and listen essentially) and a code for reporting intel. Not so much visible to the students but a major issue on voicecoms was the reporting of intel (codeword: recon). Agony had about 3 pilots constantly on watch for incoming ships. When in a system with 3 exits, this ment we received intel from those 3 gates, stating how much ships were where, what alliance and such. Other than just visual inspection local channels were checked for pilot spikes (groups entering system) and doing a 360o scan on ships scanners (for scan probes for example). The ship scanner was also used for checking out the state of a jumpgate from beyond visual range (in 5o modus).
After the theory section was over (after 2-3 hours in high/low sec) we went to truesec to find us some kills. Not quite remembering all the details on kills, losses, sequence and such, I leave this to ppl with the writing skills to offer you a juicy report.
I might add another post about bubble warfare later, if noone else chooses to adress it before that, that is.
-
How did you find the course? Worthwhile? Valuable?
What would you do differently if you were doing it again?
-
Well, the theory was... basic. And ofc you can also get theory out of texts, so all in all, theory wasnt all the most useful part of the course imo. BUT I still learned some useful things, so the theory certainly wasnt useless. The practical part was very useful. Experience here is sooo valuable. At first it was one big chaos in my eyes. 50 friendly ships swarming around, a less than perfect set up overview, busy voicecoms that stated all kinds of ships i didnt exactly know. But as the night progressed things got more easy, even when we were locked in a system or when i was podded and my pod's(!) armor was shot to half way down i managed to keep a pretty cool head (or was it just a numb head due to the beer?).
So was it worthwhile and valuable? Yes, because you get practice and ppl take time to explain things to you.
Would joining an alliance and entering pvp with them do the same thing? To some extend I do think so, yes... Nice to see the power of the hydra principle though (should explain that a bit more also, later).
What would I do differently next time?
Pff, difficult question. I'd tweak my fittings towards more dps. Not much else I think.
Will there be a next time?
Hell yeah!
-
:) Sounds good.
Aye - there's 2 things with PvP that are hard: feeling inexperienced & the fear factor.
The fear factor is a hard one - especially early on. Mostly because you work to be able to buy/fit a ship (and those pesky skills balanced & trained to use the ship & mods). It's somethign hard to get over.
Experience you only get by doing - and an organised group with experienced leaders helps a lot in getting to grips with the what, when & how.
The main difference with being in an alliance is that PvP happens every almost every day - and a day won't go by without at least 1 PvP gang being performed.
While I'm happy to join an alliance that doesn't have their own 0.0 space - it is very hard for those still getting to grips with things.
I have worked with young corpies in high-sec wars and in hostile 0.0 sieges and the do find the learning curve tough to start with.
A large part is being podded, ending back in Empire and the time to get back into 0.0 - which can be tough if you've hostile gate-camps to jump through.
-
A large part is being podded, ending back in Empire and the time to get back into 0.0 - which can be tough if you've hostile gate-camps to jump through.
Aye, thats the rough part I didnt really hit. I ended up in my pod once, but managed to join a small group of 4 ships and 4 pods in the same system (among them one of the agony flight management). We still had eyes on the way out and after a small waiting game, we got all ships together at the gatecamp and managed to kill 2 hacs i believe before most of us went down. I managed to get my already damaged pod through a bubble, powering towards the gate, jumped through, transverse few more true-/lowsec systems and reach base.
i.e. we were close to base and management made sure that ppl that found themselves left behind or podded could join group as soon as reasonably possible. I imagine that in normal warfare this will be very different and less of a 'smooth' ride.
-
If you're in an alliance that controls stations in 0.0 - then you'll set your JC there and you'll still be in 0.0.
The serious action of expansion in 0.0 (the kind of action KIA/UFA are involved in currently) happens usually around border regions of the space you control - so getting back into the action isn't tough - just tedious with gate travel. This however can be mitigated with the right kind of expansion and POS jump gates.
If you don't yet own a station in 0.0 - then it's rough to be podded - mostly due to having to deal with hostile gate-camps and you don't usually do it in larger ships if you're not in a group.
I guess you could utilise a Rorqual as a cheap alternative (it has a Clone Vat Bay) to hostile 0.0 sieges - or a MS. The issue with a MS is that you would have to buy one (rather than build) if you don't control some safe 0.0 space and they're not cheap.
But you guys did well last night - the killboard (http://www.handsofjustice.co.uk/maadikb/?a=kills) is showing some nice kills - BS's and a couple of hacs to boot!
-
Way to ruin an agony class as learned from a couple of random guys tonight.
Sit at a gate in smartbombing domi's just as 70 frigs/af's warp in...
Shit wasnt funny! (well maybe a little).
===========
Corp account with AU is 100mill or so - theyve upped class costs - and even though 0.0 is a pretty good school in itself, directed learning via such folks as Agony is damn good.
-
Glad i went as alumnus in the end - got to hear parts of the class I didnt hear last time due to being late and learned a few new tricks too. Also paid lots of attentiont o their fcing style and such - handy just for that I reckon.
-
seems ppl started to see the fun in harassing large organized fleets (GK/Agony)
I will try to remember to post in forum next time an Agony course comes around.
ppl will have to respond fast though!