Hands of Justice
What we have played => EVE Online => Topic started by: peo on January 09, 2010, 08:59:21 AM
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Tech 1 ships (Battlecruisers and above) should be insured and insurance is replaced. The amounts are stated below. Frigates and Cruisers are free to take in the corp hangar and will not be refunded in any other way.
Tech 2 ships get replaced with market value +10m to cover fits.
Capitals are not included for now but listed for future reference.
Ship:Baseprice:Platinum Insurance cost(Replacement payout)
- Carriers
- Archon:768568380:
230570514 - Chimera:733826590:
220147977 - Thanatos:844884708:
253468412.4 - nidhoggur:771957982:
231587394.6
- Battleships
- Abbadon:180000000:54000000
- Apocalypse:112500000:33750000
- Armageddon:66250000:18000000
- Rokh:165000000:49500000
- Raven:108750000:32625000
- Scorpion:71250000:21375000
- Hyperion:176000000:46500000
- Megathron:105000000:31500000
- Dominix:62500000:18750000
- Maelstrom:145000000:43500000
- Tempest:103750000:31125000
- Typhoon:75000000:22500000
- Battlecruisers
- Harbinger:38500000:11550000
- Prophecy:22500000:6750000
- Drake:38000000:11400000
- Ferox:24000000:7200000
- Brutix:27000000:8100000
- Myrmidon:40000000:12000000
- Cyclone:22500000:6750000
- Hurricane:36500000:10950000
- Cruisers
- Rupture:6875000:2062500
- Caracal:4560000:1368000
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Losses: [when payed the entry is striken]
8th January 2010: 1 Abbadon (aerie), 1 Tempest (Hrodgar), 1 Stilletto (Safran)
9th January 2010: 2 Ruptures (Hrodgar), Buzzard (Rexor)
11th January 2010: 2 Caracals (Linnea), 1 Tempest (Hrodgar)
11th March 2010: 1 Hurricane (Hrodgar)
15th March 2010: Harbinger (Dehn)
23rd March 2010: Cheetah (Hrodgar)
7th April 2010: Malediction (Aeriese)
16th April 2010: Tempest (Safran)
25th April 2010: Cheetah (hrodgar)
16th May 2010: Tempest (Hrodgar)
17th June 2010: Megathron (Dostov)
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Reserved
(don't post here pls)
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This is it in a few more words.
T1. We repay your insurance cost. ONLY if you if you insured the ship. Post in this thread when you lose a ship in PVP ONLY. In the post include a link to the loss (should be on our killboard). What we give you iskwise can be seen above.
T2. We buy a fresh ship plus give extra isk towards its fit. Frigate and Cruiser, we will give +10million. BC and BS we will give +20million. Buy a fresh ship, let us know the cost, post here with link to loss and we'll replace it.
Clones. Lose a clone that covers 71million SP or more and we'll refund the close cost.
(http://handsofjustice.co.uk/forum/gallery/1_10_01_10_7_47_09.jpg)
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There was a corp mail along these lines - that I answered about making this sort of info an actual page etc.
Figured we should just use the bulletins thingy in the corp window in game - not sure if its permission based but could someone take a gander at it?
That way its kept private - and we dont risk me breaking stuff maybe.
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Insurance
From: Secure Commerce Commission
Sent: 2010.03.11 07:34
RefID:489411391 Your friendly insurance company has transferred 36,500,000.0 ISK into your account for the recent loss of your ship.
http://handsofjustice.co.uk/maadimredux/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=745
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Lost a Harby in our war tonight :)
Insurance
From: Secure Commerce Commission
Sent: 2010.03.15 19:42
RefID:1473357508 Your friendly insurance company has transferred 38,500,000.0 ISK into your account for the recent loss of your ship.
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Dehns loss:
http://handsofjustice.co.uk/maadimredux/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=749
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So the replacement program seems to be working then?
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So the replacement program seems to be working then?
Probably, might up the sum a little to pay for modules especially when using t2 fitted ships you lose some cash. I know I lose about 2-3m per cane with the current system and that is with t1m0 guns.
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It was my initial idea to have members buy ships at market mineral prices, while it was peo's idea to offer the ships at corp mineral prices. My idea behind it was to make some money on the minerals/building, which can then be spent on the clone-/insurance-reimbursement, so as to make the ship replacement program pay itself back (~).
In my reasoning I didnt calculate the profit we are making on moon-goo however, so peo's setup might work too. I have no clue how much we are making on moon-goo with current prices though and what else we can/need to do with the corp's isk.
We might need to discuss this with some numbers thrown in.
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some simple numbers (just thinking out loud, this is no reasoning for or against anything):
Insurance reimbursement boils down to paying 30% of base cost (which in itself is higher than actual market value)
-> this is about 10M for BCs, and 20-60M for BSs
Cruisers and below are offered for free. Frigs and Desses are pretty much negligible (< 1M), cruisers range from 2-5M a pop.
All in all, it's a pretty sweet deal to our members, as they can pretty much PvP for free (extra bucks cover quite a chuck of mods too, if you don't go crazy).
Let's have a look at the insurance reimbursement value vs. the purchase price from corp:
Base price is about 1.5-2 times current corp-purchase-cost prices (depending on ship). This means the insurance (30% of base price) boils down to 45%-60% of corp purchase cost.
This means that when a member looses a ship he/she gets the insurance from EvE (= base price), plus 30% of that price extra from the corp (insurance cost reimbursement). -> So in total 130% of base price, which in itself is 1.5-2 times the purchase price => 1.95-2.6 times purchase price.
Some questions that arose during the above write-up:
- can we afford this now? yes, as not much pvp is going on in MAADI really
- can we afford this when pvp get's more frequent? dunno, i have no idea of current income
- will asking 10% extra for ships (corp purchase price vs. market price) help cover this in a significant way? when the 10% extra is equal to 100 (index), the reimbursement is 100*10*1.5*.30 up to 100*10*2*.30 = 450 to 600, which means the 10% extra will only cover 15-20% of the program (cruiser and below not included (will make it go down more))
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sooo, no ideas about this then?
or i'm just rambling, also a possibility
*shrug*
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Youve edited it with actual numbers since I read it last.
But Im leaving you folks to mainly deal with the program as on an actual usage level I'll never have a need to use it while I have isk to splurge. However as long as the program somehow still leaves us in profit and I think that as long as we dont bloat maadi with loads of members then it should be profitable both for the corp (by not pulling all our income) and for the members by encouraging them to pvp.
Your ideas seem pretty good on potentially increasing our internal sale cost (all helps profitability) for certain ship classes etc as it would be another +1 for some profitability on top of the moon stuff.
Corp mail a link out too I think, to get a bit more attention, as we do have more of a communist feel in some ways and this should carry over to the decisions process for somethings.
Not sure if ive been any help here, but going away as we finally got a handle on a program probably didnt help much :)
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Assuming the price of the crystalline carbonide stays at 100 minimum we will make (from the current reactions) about 880m isk/month. Thats almost around 80 bc insurances. So affording this isn't a problem unless people go around losing ships in the tens per month.
I can't see any reason what so ever to actually charge 10% more for the ships. It is almost a zero sum game to build at corp mineral prices as the minerals are bought from the corp mining.
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Hmm, this thread is weird as it doesnt seem to show NEW when new posts are posted...
Well, it will up the corp wallet a bit (or down a bit less). The biggest question is: do we need that?
Currently we have 5-6 B. What will happen if(!) we are ever going to set up (a) deathstar(s) etc. I have no idea about their cost. All in all at, this stage I'd rather see the wallet go up than down. For the moment the 800-1200M we make a month seems plenty. You're right on that.
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Hmm, this thread is weird as it doesnt seem to show NEW when new posts are posted...
Well, it will up the corp wallet a bit (or down a bit less). The biggest question is: do we need that?
Currently we have 5-6 B. What will happen if(!) we are ever going to set up (a) deathstar(s) etc. I have no idea about their cost. All in all at, this stage I'd rather see the wallet go up than down. For the moment the 800-1200M we make a month seems plenty. You're right on that.
A DS will cost about 1bn. But my thinking is that these costs will come from the replacement wallet as they are really mostly meant to expand that part. Will do it more slowly now as well.
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Hmm, this thread is weird as it doesnt seem to show NEW when new posts are posted...
Well, it will up the corp wallet a bit (or down a bit less). The biggest question is: do we need that?
Currently we have 5-6 B. What will happen if(!) we are ever going to set up (a) deathstar(s) etc. I have no idea about their cost. All in all at, this stage I'd rather see the wallet go up than down. For the moment the 800-1200M we make a month seems plenty. You're right on that.
A DS will cost about 1bn. But my thinking is that these costs will come from the replacement wallet as they are really mostly meant to expand that part. Will do it more slowly now as well.
I dont follow :S
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Insurance
From: Secure Commerce Commission
Sent: 2010.03.25 13:42
RefID:426255070 Your friendly insurance company has transferred 731,768.00 ISK into your account for the recent loss of your ship. This payout is the default payout for an uninsured ship. If you are interested in better insurance then please visit a station with an Insurance Service for further details.
http://handsofjustice.co.uk/maadimredux/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=769
Lost a cov-ops when probing moons.
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Experiment failed... *sulks*
Insurance
From: Secure Commerce Commission
Sent: 2010.04.16 14:05
RefID:1631031768 Your friendly insurance company has transferred 103.750.000 ISK into your account for the recent loss of your ship.
will pay myself 31.125M...
well, maybe i could have gotten 1 of them, if I hadnt tried to get back to the gate first :\
I first escaped from them, but then though wtf and went back... then i tried to escape again ::) I should really make up my mind in situations like this...
http://handsofjustice.co.uk/maadimredux/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=791
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Insurance
From: Secure Commerce Commission
Sent: 2010.05.16 19:13
RefID:1573537740 Your friendly insurance company has transferred 103,750,000.0 ISK into your account for the recent loss of your ship.
Fail fleet is fail hehe 53 in fleet mostly RR bs (medium range idiocy) 1kill 10+ losses.
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I almost forgot about the changes they made to insurance...
It now costs 20M to insure a Tempest, and payout is a meager 68M. That's pretty lame...
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Dostov lost his mega he was evaccing from Fountain (unlucky loss):
http://handsofjustice.co.uk/maadi3kb/index.php?a=kill_detail&kll_id=853
31,500,000 will transferred shortly. I asked Dostov in game.
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drake earlier this month (june 6th): 7,340,481 - 24,468,270
cyclone: 4,629,387.60 - 15,431,292
for when we have decided how to handle losses... or have we?
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drake earlier this month (june 6th): 7,340,481 - 24,468,270
cyclone: 4,629,387.60 - 15,431,292
for when we have decided how to handle losses... or have we?
Use the old for now if you are ok with that? We don't lose a significant amount at the moment so should work decently until we figure out something better.
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old is just insurance cost right?
yeah we should manage that just fine :)
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Will pay out 24.5M to myself today. For drake and cyclone loss above (from before insurance overhaul), plus 12.5M for Stilettoloss during Agony course.
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Old.
So unstickied.