Author Topic: Ma'adim: Direction?  (Read 22688 times)

Offline Jarkko

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #30 on: January 03, 2009, 10:29:32 PM »
Is there any general map available that shows the where abouts of different corps in 0.0? Sort of hard to follow at times the discussions (especially on the EVE official forums) regarding different corps, when you have no clue where they usually roam :)

Offline Mangala

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #31 on: January 03, 2009, 10:31:49 PM »
This shows ALliances, which when I talk about UFA & TCF is what i mean. Corps rarely hold space on their own, its always as part of an alliance.

http://dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Verite/influence.png

We are interested in Geminate, which is to the east of The Forge region on the map.
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Offline vacuum

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #32 on: January 03, 2009, 11:05:37 PM »
J'aime le TCF :-)

Offline peo

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #33 on: January 04, 2009, 06:04:23 AM »
UFA wasn't holding much space haha :)
Looks like what? 3-4 systems? or am I reading the map wrong?
Of course for a start that is enough to keep a thight hold on :)

Offline vacuum

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #34 on: January 04, 2009, 06:15:05 PM »
That's not a bad place to start, the alternative is you take too much space, then can't defend it ...

Offline Rubino

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #35 on: January 04, 2009, 06:28:22 PM »
UFA is part of KIA - and with good relationships with TCF give us quite some scope to the east and north.
J7HZ is north east of Geminate and is part of 3 regions of drone space (which iirc can't be claimed) - at some point it would be worth having a POS in this region as part of a jump network which would allow harvesting of drone NPC's for minerals.

The only issue is that I don't know the relationship with Goon - and we have members with Goon alts...



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Offline vacuum

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #36 on: January 04, 2009, 06:31:46 PM »
TCF are +ve
KIA are broadly +ve, but EDDZ can be random.

Also, if we ever reset standings and actively end up in conflict, we'll discuss 'the right thing' but probably me taking a break from game for a bit is correct.


Offline peo

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #37 on: January 04, 2009, 06:33:49 PM »
+ve?

Offline Mangala

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #38 on: January 04, 2009, 06:36:05 PM »
+ve?

Positive, ie friendly.

Eddz and random = massive understatement :D
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Offline vacuum

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #39 on: January 04, 2009, 06:40:35 PM »
Goons are + to TCF (Superb +10)
Goons are + to KIA (Good +5)
Goons are = to UFA (Neutral)

http://standings.goonfleet.com/
« Last Edit: January 04, 2009, 06:45:46 PM by vacuum »

Offline peo

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #40 on: January 04, 2009, 07:08:15 PM »
Goons are + to TCF (Superb +10)
Goons are + to KIA (Good +5)
Goons are = to UFA (Neutral)

http://standings.goonfleet.com/


Would suspect that the neutral has mostly to do with the small size of ufa?

Offline vacuum

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #41 on: January 04, 2009, 07:31:40 PM »
Right, and the fact that they're not really in conflicting space, so unlikely to bump into each other.

Offline Warcold

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #42 on: January 16, 2009, 11:02:53 AM »
Mate of mine seems to be still playing EvE (thought he'd quit). He is in an alliance that is just starting and planning to pull into 0.0 in a while. Not really what we are looking for i reccon, but I'll have a chat with him tonight nonetheless.

His corp is Legacy Syndicate, alliance is www.redflagsovereignty.com

[edit]hmm, browsed their forum and the alliance doesnt seem very mature, in more senses of the word, but lets see what my mate has to say[/edit]
« Last Edit: January 16, 2009, 11:28:42 AM by Warcold »
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Offline vacuum

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #43 on: January 16, 2009, 11:38:02 AM »
His corp is Legacy Syndicate, alliance is www.redflagsovereignty.com

[edit]hmm, browsed their forum and the alliance doesnt seem very mature, in more senses of the word, but lets see what my mate has to say[/edit]

Be very careful with new alliances. They tend to be full of egos and pratts. That said, if he's a good mate and a decent fit, poach him for ma'adim.

Offline Rubino

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Re: Ma'adim: Direction?
« Reply #44 on: January 16, 2009, 12:31:51 PM »
Ideally an alliance should already be in 0.0 with systems that contain stations.

Taking hostile space is very do-able but the target system/region should contain a conquerable station as POS refining is pretty inefficient.

While I'm up for taking hostile space it poses a number of issues that need to be considered.  Bearing these in mind - if you think the leaders of the alliance are capable of such.
Additionally the MADDI should have an equal footing in the alliance and be part of all strategy and direction.  Without this - taking hostile space means you end up being just fodder - both during the siege and after when it comes to offices, refining tax, etc.

  • You're going to be taking space away from somebody and somebody with friends (meta alliances essentially boil down to one of the 2 main factions in eve - Bob & Goon) - if you don't have cap ship support you're asking for trouble.
  • Taking hostile space isn't trivial - it's not hard but it's not easy.  It takes numbers - and the more of the 23 hour clock you cover the better.  Additionally your cap ship pilots need to be on at the same time for when sieges happen.

It takes a lot of ISK to take space from somebody.  You've fuel, ammo, replacements, supplies, POS's (their fittings and fuel) needed - a fighting fund of at least 10b - probably several times this is needed.
If memory serves me right from my last experience of taking a region - you're looking at 30-40b isk.  Vac can probably provide a more current figure on this.


Essentially the process of taking populated 0.0 space involves..

1) Intel:
Have good friends that support your action (not just a NAP) which can and will provide support (Capital support)
Pick optimal systems within that fit your relationships with friendly alliances
Scout out any moons that don't have POS's up, determining POS's and their defences, gathering intel on pilots in the constellation and travel patterns
Make strategic BMs for the systems in the region (Station, Moons, Belts, sniper points, gates, safe-spots)
Do the math to determine supplies, POS's & ISK needed to take sov and the campaign

2) Prep:
Getting your alliance corps into position at the entry points to the region
Buying Stontium, jump fuel & ammo for the dreads & cynos
Distributing the BM's and getting cyno alts into position
Ensuring you have replacement ships in the JF's, carriers, etc - you're gonna need spare, well equipped ships on hand for people at 0 cost
Buying POS's, POS modules, stront (a lot) and fuel which will be put into the system/region
Ensuring you have enough bubbles, etc to lock down the system

3) Siege:
Numbers are the game - you need to ensure you have enough pilots in system/region around the clock to lock down traffic
a) You have at least 1 empty moon in system - drop the POS & POS fittings to create a safe location in system for your forces.  The more empty moons the better.  Use as much Stront as possible to give you a window of defence
b) If you don't have an empty moon - then you'll need to take out one of their POS's by bringing in Dreads and sieging the POS (you can do it with BS if the POS is a poor setup and you don't mind it taking a loooooong time). As soon as the POS is down - do (a)
The math from (1) kicks in - you'll need to out match sov from their POS's with yours and the cycle works over the number of DT's.
Once you have sov and there's a station in system (ideal) the real fun kicks in with a station siege.  You'll again need to have the system locked down and dreads on hand to break down the station shields to claim it.

4) Defence:
You'll need to maintain high numbers in the system/region for several weeks to ensure there's no bounce-back.
Additionally you'll need to push out and ensure you control the gates between empire space -> 0.0 (and entry points into the region) as much as possible - if not 23/7 - so having high active numbers in the alliance matters a lot. 

Timeframes:
In terms of the time it takes from start to end - you're looking at somewhere in the region of 2-8 weeks.  Agains Vac can probably provide more current information on this.  I think we when took Geminate it took 6 weeks or so from the start until we felt established in our new home.

Deploying your own station:
While putting up a station isn't hard or particularly expensive (a few billion ISK) - the risk is.  Without support (from other alliances) you could be buying the other side a nice shiney toy.

Profit (risk/reward):
The ways to make profit from 0.0 have been discussed in other threads but when you've finally finished and have a shiney new station to live in (even better if MADDI is the corp controlling it) - now you can start making an income.  Up until now everything has been an expense.  A rough guess is that you'll start making a profit after about the same time it took to take the space - so if it took 6 weeks to take the system(s) - about 6 weeks after living there you'll break even.
 

MADDI Capabilities:
From a siege perspective - what we can offer as a corp to the alliance (thinking off the top of my head so "update" me if I'm wrong :P ):
Sub BS Ships, modules & ammo (we won't be able to charge for these in a siege and while we can make BS's our mining side doesn't bring in enough mins to make it a production line affair)
Transportation between empire and 0.0 (ships, fuel, supplies, POS's, etc)
Corp POS's, POS modules, POS Fuel (2 or 3 - maybe more)
1 or 2 Carrier pilots (I think Beo might have one that's about ready)
1 or 2 Dread Pilots (same as the above)
3 or 4 Orca Pilots (spare ships, transportation, in-space fitting and fleet boosting)
5+ BS able pilots (BS, HAC, HI, dictor type)
5+ PvP Pilots (BC or smaller)
1 or 2b ISK

« Last Edit: January 16, 2009, 12:43:50 PM by Rubino »



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