Roles in a fleet

[Pashur]

Hi guys,
I am in need of some advice. I had a dream of getting a battleship one day but I am starting to realize I will never have the economy to support that. I also have the feeling that I have started a race where I will never catch up. I have always been a min-maxing kind of guy when playing MMOs but in Eve I only see a wall of skills to climb and the need of Croesus gold vault.
So, I have decided to lower my ambitions and try to find a "cheaper" role to play. I remember this topic was discussed in some thread way back but I never found it back and at the time I knew even less what it was all about.
I am sure there are roles in a fleet for more laidback gamers where they can still contribute. I know there are tacklers, scouts and electronic platforms and got a rough idea of what they do. However I don't know if these roles, with smaller ships, still need to use dead expensive equipment to be useful or if training appropriate skills takes years. Not that I am in a hurry but my patience do have limits. Is there something MAADI is in great need of?
Any role suggestion would be appreciated.

[Mangala]

Tacklers - a few hours out of the tutorial and you can do that well enough.  A few missions every so often and you can pay for your ships. To be good takes at most 30/40 days - fitting skills to IV/V, ship skills for frigates to V, navigation skills to IV and even V in some of them. Hell could even make it into AF's in that time and use them to tackle (I do ).

Scouts - little more skill intensive, but shares alot with tacklers in the initial areas, then branches off into electronics for cloaking and such. To be really good throw in scanning skills and some basic tackle training. (Wouldnt mind a cloaky whore or two for nights out on a roam )

EWAR - frigate ewar is very cheap and throwaway. Stick to things like the Griffin (Caldari ewar frig) rather than skilling into the Electronic Attack Ships. Skills to IV are good as they open up the T2 fittings gear.  Ewar done right and you wont die alot.  Or there are Ewar cruisers - T1 and the Force Recons - T2 variants..

In fact for bang for your buck, getting into drones and drone cruisers is a great bet for a more casual player.  They work as well in PVE as they do in PVP - so you can do stuff to earn some income - and given the number of drone skills can keep you going for a long time before you run that course down.

Basically - everything at sub-BC level can be learned to a good standard within a month to 45 days at most, following which you can then go through maxing out supoort skills in those areas.  There isnt a need to use T2 or faction gear unless you have the sort of isk to throwaway (lol at my recent 70million isk loss of an Assault Frigate ), you can mission to make isk to buy stuff, or mine and sell it to the corp for money, as well as having access to our corp hangars for ships/modules anyways

[Jarkko]

Good post Mangala    I wish I had known this when I began to play, thinking a T2 ship is a must to be of any use anywhere   This week I have learned more of this game than the previous months

[Mangala]

T2 ships basically open up more options within their ship size and more roles over all - theres not much they do that cant be done by a T1 variant in the hands of someone who has worked his skills out and trained well for them. 

[Caradir]

if you watched the alliance tourney you would have seen a few teams field Navy Caracals in a Ewar misiile platform role, which shows that T1 ships are very useful.

in fact the only differences between the navy version and normal one (beyond the more armour/shields and better resists) is an extra high and a few lows. the mediums are the same.

[Mangala]

And a price tag even greater than a T2 variant usually

[Rubino]

Start and think smaller but with a little time you'll find yourself within reach of a Battleship - and there's lots of fun to be had along the way.
Battlecruisers are very good platforms and allow you to do everything from missions to 0.0 npc's - the skills you learn for the smaller ships in the list that Beo has mentioned help a lot towards the bigger ones. 

Eve can be very overwhelming and everything can appear very expensive - and with many things at the smaller end of things the corp can help. 
I believe Beo has been working on some things to make ships/mods/ammo easier and with luck more info will be coming soon(tm)

[Bethor]

Just go for your dream of flying a BS. it should be possible in 1-2 months. and if you put your heart to it, it is easily affordable.

if you go solo, just run missions. for 1 corp. lvl 1 missions can be done in about every frig. skip flying destroyers.
you do need to fly cruisers to get you through the lvl 2 missions, and i think the lvl 3s can also be done with them.

As soon as you can afford it buy a bc, than you can do lvl 3's for sure and if correctly fitted you can fly lvl 4's solo with it too (i do with my drake)

Skillwise just look up the learning skills and get all the "cheap" skills to lvl 4 than the "expensive" to lvl 3 and the cheaps to lvl 5. saves a hell of a lot of training (you might want to use eve mon to see in what order you can train them most effectively) After that your focus should be fitting a savager after that weapons. You also might want to wonder a bit on battleclinic to see what bs you want to fly with what fitting and load that in eve mon, as the ultimate plan you are training for. If in the meanwhile you run into something else you might want to explore, my advice is, go for it. Make a new skill plan for it and just train as long as you feel it is worth it. When you want to get back you can just switch plans. Nothing is really lost Just it is an absolute must to get those learning skills up asap (and yes it is boring as hell, but if you want to play eve for a year or longer it is worth every hour of training)

Also about the learning skills. The advanced lvl V's i wouldn't train them. Huge discussions going on about them on the eve fora, but generally speaking you wont actually benefit from them unless you train continuasly for like 3 years or something like that.

You also might want to get attribute implants. Generally you'll get them as rewards for flying storyline missions (always and i mean ALWAYS fly storyline missions. The do wonders for your faction standings and they have the best rewards, things like implants or huge amounts of isk)

the savager greatly increases your income when flying lvl 3 missions and above.

If you now have time you might want to skill for a destroyer, fit it with 4 salvagers 4 tractorbeams and cargo expanders. and AB might be nice to. This is your salvaging rig. Giving you fast access to salvage the missions you fly, and loot the wrecks of the foes you killed in the mission.

if you look out a bit you should be able to at least purchase a bs in about a month (if not less) after you started flying lvl 3 missions. You probably find a some of the mods you want to fit to your BS flying the lvl 3 missions and looting the ships.

so basically you should at least have the economic support to fly a bs as soon as you flown some lvl 3s. Also look out for the quality of the agents, the better the quality the better your rewards. There are also some skills that improve agent quality and reward amount and such.

... Erm well since it is starting to look much like a rant ATM i guess I'll stop i hope it is of use to you.

[Warcold]

and concerning you running a losing game:
we are flying in lowsec with players a few weeks old in frigates, also fulfilling their role. Esp. E-war is very useful and pretty easy to train in. Here is a guide i put together on e-war, including skills needed and ships that give bonuses. As you'll see most ships are frigates and cruisers, which are very low on skill requirements.

[Pashur]

Thanks for all replies guys

I will get some 5-6 frigates set up this weekend. They will be setup mainly for tackling/EWAR but refitting to lasers is ofc possible.
Since I am Amarr I will have some Crucifiers, Executioners and Punishers.  I am not at lvl 4 in jamming/disruption/ewar but I can fit the starting modules. Any Nos-neu combo is also ok.

Thanks Bethor for the roadmap to a BS. In due time I may fly one but I doubt I have the perseverance. Not now anyway. I am getting more and more allergic to grinding, irrespective of MMO.
For the time being I will aim for tackling/EWAR and maybe later head for cov ops or go cruiser/BC. I have never played the sneaky rogue type but why not now.

I have some logistic questions. How shall I organize myself in terms of ship storage locations with respect to expected area of action and jump clone location?
I have two jump clones at the MAADI recommended locations.
/ciao

[Mangala]

Im leaning more towards keeping is roaming hisec local to our HQ, but i'd suggest move a clone to Mista in Domain anyways - we may get bored and want to shoot/be shot at by CVA some more

As for the ships - contract all you want moving to Mista to Thera and she'll happily run you some stuff down

[Bethor]

well if you dislike grinding you can either go for:
1 mining/manufacturing (works best with 2 accounts though)
2 exploration (need combat skills for that too though)
3 piracy.. Nothing like a bit YARing and PEW PEW to get your isk
4 trader. Get a big transport and fly stuff from a to b (sit on a region border to get more price info)
5 mission runner (ok pure grinding)
6 low sec ratter (much like missionrunner only higher suspense and risks (pirates gooing pew pew on you) also better rewards)

there is probably more if you look for it but these are valid professions you could go for instead of just pure grinding.

[Pashur]

...contract all you want moving to Mista to Thera and she'll happily run you some stuff down

I will try. I find the whole contract system very intimidating 
Mista V Moon 4 - Ishukone....  or?

[Mangala]

works ok for me

[Pashur]

works ok for me

Hehe, I am sure it is working. I just remember the one and only contract I've made. My Alt needed money for a mining barge. I was sure the money was gone but I found them back alright. In Eve you just cannot get a flashy mail icon saying click here someone sent you something. I am sure it is to scare off new players.